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Kirsten MiddekeKeymaster
You’re supposed to give your sourdough a name, because it’s a living organism and apparently people are better at caring for organisms when they have names. Mine doesn’t have a name, and I’ve had it for months. Suggestions?
- This reply was modified 3 years, 9 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterIt’s possible (and useful) to teach grammar without using grammatical terminology. If you don’t talk about grammar at all, you’re probably not actually teaching. Some schools have language assistants to offer their expertise as native speakers in addition to the teacher, who does the actual teaching. Be careful not to eliminate your own (prospective) jobs by claiming that we don’t actually need people who are able to offer explicit instruction in the language. If you just hope that people are going to pick it up themselves, what should we pay you for? 🙂
I agree that authentic input is important, but learners of a language as a second language differ from children acquiring their first language in that they already speak a language, so they already have linguistic habits that need to be un-learned to a certain extent, and in that they have less time because they have a lot to do besides learning the language. That’s why we do want to give people explicit instruction. A lot can be done to help them learn more effectively.Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterThe phrase is from a poster that announced a talk, it was about teaching grammar without mentioning grammar.
You’re perfectly right, of course, it’s impossible to teach (or to use) language without grammar. But YouTube has many videos with titles like “Learn English without grammar”, and many of my own former students of German said things like “Ich suche einen Konversationskurs, ich möchte lieber ohne Grammatik Deutsch lernen.” So my question is: how can we teach grammar without talking about grammar? 🙂Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterAh, thanks, Alexander, for pointing this out! It’s really hard to see in a small font, I didn’t notice. Here’s the Polish alphabet with the proper <ł>=/w/: https://images.lingvozone.com/languages/Language%20Information31_files/image001.gif
But since <ɫ> and <ł> are probably never in contrastive distribution, the difference doesn’t lead to any confusion luckily.
Polish /w/ developed out of Proto-Slavic /l/, via Old Polish /ɫ/, where original /l/ was followed by another consonant, if I understand correctly. Wikipedia lists some of the relavant sound changes at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Polish#Phonetic_processes_from_Proto-Slavic, based on Stanisław Rospond. 2005. Gramatyka historyczna języka polskiego, Warszawa-Wrocław it seems (there’s no proper citation in the text, only a references list). It seems as if the change /ɫ/>/w/ (vocalization) happened in the 16th century, after Polish already had an orthography based on the Latin alphabet (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L-vocalization#Polish_and_Sorbian, information from Leksykon terminów i pojęć dialektologicznych, s.v. Wałczenie), and probably, as Alexander says, after [l] and [ɫ] had become different phonemes as other sound changes created minimal pairs.
Maybe we can ask Magdalena for confirmation/more information.- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterWell, I’d be the last person to claim that etymology and historical linguistics aren’t fascinating. 🙂 We should look at the synchronic and the diachronic dimension. But we have to keep them apart conceptually. Your example with the names is a good one. I can certainly study the etymology of names (and also their morphology), but the fact that someone is called Müller or Krüger or Potter or Miller (derivation, root {mill} + agent-suffix {er}) doesn’t tell us anything about the person. It tells us something about their distant ancestors, but that doesn’t predict anything about today.
(Btw, do you know Schirm Schirmer in Steglitz?)
- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterHere’s a case in point (text by Stefan Hartman):
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XKofHun-RSkUfB2aE53szwN4I1Mk2l0f3crIPTO6OT0/editKirsten MiddekeKeymasterI thought so, too. Unfortunately, the German corpora I have access to don’t seem to distinguish number in nouns, so I can’t use them to find out which is the most frequent.
In any case, the fact that so many people seem to believe that {s} is the usual one suggests that {s} is the most productive. What happens when new words enter the language, for example through borrowing from other languages. Which plurals do you use then?Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterDear Jozielly,
We won’t do syntax until next week, so instead of a definition I’ll give you examples for the time being.
sentence: They have always been the same thing to me, but apparently they are not. (everything between two full stops)
clause: They have always been the same thing to me.
clause: But apparently they are not. (everything that belongs to the same verb)
phrase: the same thing
phrase: to me (everything that stays together when moved or replaced)- This reply was modified 3 years, 11 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterIs /p/ aspirated in Alpaca?
- This reply was modified 3 years, 12 months ago by Kirsten Middeke.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterAnd to clarify (this came up in the seminar today): a phoneme is a unit of language. Phonemes are bundles of features (/p/ is a voiceless bilabial stop), and features that differentiate between phonemes in a specific language are called contrastive features. So voicing is a contrastive feature in English, because there are minimal pairs that differ only with respect to voicing (pit vs. bit). You can also say that voicing is phonologically relevant in English, or that aspiration is phonologically relevant (i.e. meaning-distinguishing) in Russian but not in English. (Can someone post a minimal pair from Russian?)
Do try to use linguistic terminology, it makes it a lot easier to understand what you mean and to decide whether what you’re suggesting is correct or not.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterYes, there is something to add.
Minimal pairs are defined as the smallest meaning- distinguishing units in language. That means that the meaning can change when only one letter is different in a word. For example the letters /p/ (voiceless bilabial plosive) and /b/ (voiced bilabial plosive) only deviate in the voicing and are therefore two different sounds. These two letters change the whole meaning of a word: pit- die Grube, bit- das Stückchen.
The smallest meaning-distinguishing unit in language is a phoneme. That meanst that meaning can change if only one phoneme is changed. /p/ and /b/ are phonemes/sounds, NOT letters. (PLEASE stop talking about letters. Letters don’t matter. Knit and wit is a minimal pair, even though two letters are different.)
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterYou misidentified one of the words and you didn’t answer the second question.
Kirsten MiddekeKeymaster(I just took out some code from Jozielly’s answer, to make it readable.)
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterProbably not. But the question is: why does it work for words that we do know?
Kirsten MiddekeKeymasterSo let’s say I say things like
- weil(,) ich habe die Antworten noch nicht korrigiert
- you and me should talk
- wegen dem Lockdown geht das jetzt nicht
Does this bother you? How much variation can you tolerate?
(I find it difficult to come up with examples for English, can anyone help?)
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